[Grovenet] When the Arctic was balmy

[Meredith Bliss]

I think Robert is an eternal optimist who is just noting that life will go on. 
Even if we poison ourselves out of existence, the liverworts and cockroaches 
will survive.

And about the poles: as I recall, they also have a tendency to flip (reverse 
completely) as opposed to the wandering to which you refer. Also very 
traumatic for life on the Earth.

I could never take the "Gaia Hypothesis" very seriously, those who suggest 
that Earth acts as a homeostatic "being" that always tends to restore the 
balance. It certainly didn't do much for the sulfur bacteria that used to be 
the predominant life form before oxygen began to accumulate. That really put 
a crimp in their lifestyle.

On Friday 02 June 2006 07:15, Eric Canon wrote:
> --- Robert VanNatta <robert at vannattabros.com>
>
> wrote:
> > Historically, it has been both very warm and
> > very cold.   certainly this
> > area was under glaciers in the last ice age.
>
> You are correct, but don't forget to mention
> "over thousands and millions of years". The
> changes that are happening now are rapid, and not
> related to meteor strikes. Combine that with the
> climatic difficulties which would displace life
> as we know it today, possibly creating conditions
> that even preclude human existence, and you paint
> a truer picture.
>
> > Similarly you can look at Glacier Bay in SE
> > Alaska which barely existed as
> > Captain Cook described it, to deep enough now
> > that Cruise ships run up it.
> > Likewise the retreating ice there has exposed
> > giant stumps from 'really old
> > growth timber'  --- tree stumps  from before
> > the last ice age that are now
> > being exposed.
> >
> > The eco system is never quite stable, but has a
> > way of righting itself, and
> > when co2 goes up, the plants grow more
> > vigorously and pull it back down.
>
> Again, over time, yes, but, even then, if it gets
> hot, is there a place for humanity? If the
> problem is caused by human activity, and there is
> abundant evidence that is the situation, can we
> just continue on and expect the earth to adjust?
>
> > The other thing of course that the discovery at
> > the 'north pole' doesn't
> > acknowledge is that that location hasn't always
> > been the north pole.
>
> Are you suggesting that these scientists
> overlooked location? That doesn't give them much
> respect if that's your position. And, one other
> point: I'm not an expert by any stretch of the
> imagination, but these shifts in the poles that
> you bring to our attention are factual and
> established, but, if memory serves, the shifts
> are over a relatively small area of our planet.
> It is not like some area on the equator ever
> served as a north or south pole. The general area
> "up there" or "down there" has always been in
> relative proximity to the poles. Perhaps we have
> an expert on this list who could confirm or deny
> this for us.
>
> > Physicists write that the earth has changed it
> > polarity several times over
> > the ages.    The magnetic north has wandered a
> > long ways from the geographic
> > north, and the very fact that we have seasons
> > is caused by the earth rocking
> > on its axis.
> >
> > All of these things suggest a very traumatic
> > past, and cosmic events may
> > well have caused the earth to spin differently.
> >   Thus the findings are
> > interesting but what they prove is less clear.
>
> I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I
> interpret the point of your response to your
> implied belief that the evidence does not yet
> warrant any alarm on our parts resulting in
> behavior change. Is that correct? You believe the
> earth will self correct and we can go right on
> burning our fuels and living like there is no
> problem.
>
> If that's the case, I do not share your position
> at all, and I would offer our children are placed
> at great risk by such a position. I mean Robert,
> they are going to be really busy trying to pay
> back our debt, let alone trying to grow Doug fir
> trees when Oregon's climate resembles Baja!
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-- 
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Just happy to be here, but speaking 
only for myself!
Meredith Bliss --- www.rdrop.com/~mbliss
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