[Grovenet] And so it continues, at least until 01-20-2008 ! ! ! ! !

[Katie Allnutt]

Ron Paul has great ideas about suing your neighbor if he pollutes  
your water or your land or even your air.  But that still leaves the  
victim with the cost of proof.
So many of our toxic problems stem from pollutants left from years  
earlier where the polluter made big bucks while illegally disposing  
of stuff, then sold the land to someone else and now the original  
polluter is off in the Cayman islands untouchable.  Good luck getting  
redress for your terminal cancer from the new owner....
And what about the particulates and pollutants in the air from big  
power plants in Ohio but you live in Pennsylvania and have asthma?  
You'd have to have a class action suit to get enough clout to get  
anywhere and then you'd still have a hard time proving causation.
By comparison, the advantage of regulation is that it seeks to  
prevent the cancers/illness from happening in the first place.  The  
difficulty with suing after the fact is that the damage has already  
been done.  Sort of like having the Chinese put date rape drug  
compounds in your kids toys.  You can do it until you get caught.  
Then getting sued just becomes part of the cost of doing business.

And how will the Bushies ever vote for a guy who wants to admit that  
Bush made a mistake in Iraq and pull out?  Bush still has a 25%  
approval rating. Assuming that approx half of the country is  
Republican than means half of the R's are behind Bush and wouldn't  
support Ron Paul.

The numbers don't look too good for the guy.  But he is awfully cute.

Katie
Wouldn't a Huckabee/Paul or Paul/Huckabee ticket just blow  
everybody's mind....



On Nov 26, 2007, at 5:38 PM, Steven wrote:

> Ron Paul.
>
> Bob Browning wrote:
>> You are wondering when this kink of Keystone Cops fumbling and  
>> bumbling
>> is going to stop?? Well, guess what, Bucky, after looking at all the
>> candidates, from the Rs to the Ds, likely the only people who  
>> would care
>> about doing something suffer from "Jimmy Carteritis" and are  
>> unlikely to
>> be able to do anything.
>>
>> So, Ron and Steven and Mike and all the rest, who you gonna support!!
>>
>> I am now convinced that we are in for a long run, with Mike  
>> Huckabee the
>> eventual winner!! Remember, you heard it here first!!
>>
>> bob "what the heck??" browning
>>
>> ***************************************
>>>
>>>
>>>   Blackwater probe stifled by conflicts
>>>
>>> By RICHARD LARDNER, Associated Press Writer/ 39 minutes ago/
>>>
>>> The State Department's acerbic top auditor wasn't happy when Justice
>>> Department officials told one of his aides to leave the room so they
>>> could discuss a criminal investigation of Blackwater Worldwide, the
>>> contractor protecting U.S. diplomats in Iraq.
>>>
>>> The episode reveals the badly strained relationship between Bush
>>> administration officials over the probe into whether Blackwater
>>> smuggled weapons into Iraq that could have gotten into  
>>> insurgents' hands.
>>>
>>> As a result of the bureaucratic crosscurrents between State's top
>>> auditor and Justice, the investigation has been bogged down for  
>>> months.
>>>
>>> A key date was July 11, when Howard Krongard, State's inspector
>>> general, sent an e-mail to one of his assistant inspector generals,
>>> telling him to "IMMEDIATELY" stop work on the Blackwater
>>> investigation. That lead to criticisms by Democrats that Krongard  
>>> has
>>> tried to protect Blackwater and block investigations into
>>> contractor-related wrongdoing in Iraq.
>>>
>>> "Instead of cooperating, Mr. Krongard apparently created a series of
>>> obstacles to the inquiry," said Rep. Henry Waxman, D-Calif.,  
>>> chairman
>>> of the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee examining
>>> Krongard's performance as the State Department official responsible
>>> for stamping out waste, fraud and abuse.
>>>
>>> Krongard, whose credibility was damaged by the recent disclosure  
>>> that
>>> his brother had a business affiliation with Blackwater, has disputed
>>> the charge, though he recused himself from Blackwater matters after
>>> the potential conflict of interest emerged.
>>>
>>> His aide, Terry Heide, who was kicked out of the July 31 meeting,  
>>> also
>>> says she's been unfairly blamed for slowing the Blackwater probe.  
>>> Her
>>> role was to collect State Department documents for the  
>>> investigators -
>>> a job she did well, according to her lawyer. But even Krongard's own
>>> staff saw her as a hindrance.
>>>
>>> Brian Rubendall, a senior State Department investigator, has
>>> questioned the halt in the inquiry, telling the oversight  
>>> committee in
>>> an October interview that there was no justifiable "reason for us to
>>> stop that investigation. None."
>>>
>>> Krongard said he put the brakes on because he was concerned a  
>>> separate
>>> audit of Blackwater contracts might "contaminate" the Justice
>>> Department's work.
>>>
>>> Blackwater has called the smuggling allegations baseless. However,
>>> earlier this year two former Blackwater employees pleaded guilty to
>>> possession of stolen firearms that were shipped in interstate or
>>> foreign commerce. They are cooperating with federal agents.  
>>> Blackwater
>>> said the two were fired after it was learned they were stealing from
>>> the company.
>>>
>>> Altogether, the trail of internal e-mails, testimony from a Nov. 14
>>> oversight hearing and interviews with participants form a picture of
>>> bureaucratic infighting with consequences far beyond Washington.
>>>
>>> The State Department's role in the Blackwater weapons probe began
>>> months before the Sept. 16 Baghdad shootings by Blackwater guards  
>>> that
>>> killed 17 Iraqis and escalated public scrutiny of the company.
>>>
>>> In March, Ron Militana, a special agent in the investigations unit,
>>> received Rubendall's approval to interview State Department  
>>> personnel
>>> and meet with Blackwater attorneys about allegations the company was
>>> illegally transporting arms into Iraq. Militana also discussed
>>> potential criminal proceedings in the case with a federal  
>>> prosecutor.
>>>
>>> In late June, John DeDona, then chief of the IG's investigative  
>>> unit,
>>> e-mailed Krongard and his deputy, William Todd, to alert them to the
>>> probe. Krongard responded cryptically: "Please do not treat anything
>>> in the e-mail below as having been seen by me, advised to me, or
>>> understood or approved by me. If there is something significant  
>>> in the
>>> message below, please come and tell me about it."
>>>
>>> Two weeks later, as Militana was trying to obtain copies of  
>>> Blackwater
>>> contracts from the department's Bureau of Diplomatic Security,  
>>> DeDona
>>> sent another message to Krongard telling him of Militana's work.
>>>
>>> In a July 11 e-mail to DeDona, Krongard told him Militana was to
>>> "IMMEDIATELY" stop the work. Krongard said he wanted a briefing from
>>> the U.S. Attorney's office in North Carolina on its Blackwater
>>> investigation before his agents went farther.
>>>
>>> Waxman and other critics say Howard Krongard's order to halt came at
>>> the same time Blackwater CEO Erik Prince was considering whether to
>>> offer his brother, Alvin "Buzzy" Krongard, a spot on the company's
>>> newly forming advisory board.
>>>
>>> On July 26, Prince invited Alvin Krongard to join Blackwater's
>>> advisory board. A week later, Robert Higdon, chief of the criminal
>>> division in the U.S. Attorney's office for the eastern district of
>>> North Carolina, and James Candelmo, Higdon's deputy, were in
>>> Washington for the July 31 meeting with Krongard and his  
>>> investigators.
>>>
>>> Blackwater is based in Moyock, N.C.
>>>
>>> Howard Krongard initially said his brother had no ties to  
>>> Blackwater.
>>> But during the Nov. 14 oversight hearing, he recused himself from
>>> inquiries related to the company, explaining that Alvin Krongard had
>>> just told him he had attended an advisory board meeting. Alvin
>>> Krongard resigned from the board two days later because of the  
>>> uproar
>>> the arrangement created.
>>>
>>> While Democrats claimed a glaring conflict of interest, Krongard  
>>> said
>>> he pulled his staff off the Blackwater probe so they wouldn't  
>>> step on
>>> work being done by Stuart Bowen, the special inspector general for
>>> Iraq reconstruction.
>>>
>>> Bowen had sought help from Krongard's office to audit two Blackwater
>>> contracts — the same ones Militana was helping the U.S. Attorney's
>>> office examine, according to Krongard, who said alarms went off when
>>> he realized the potential overlap.
>>>
>>> "To be assisting a criminal investigation into the exact same two
>>> contracts that we were already assisting a civil audit into,  
>>> raised a
>>> question of parallel proceedings, which needed to be deconflicted
>>> before one infected or contaminated the other," he said.
>>>
>>> Krongard did not say what the contracts are for or give their value.
>>> The State Department pays Blackwater and two other firms $570  
>>> million
>>> a year for security services.
>>>
>>> In a deposition to the oversight committee, Todd, the deputy  
>>> inspector
>>> general, supported Krongard. "We had basically several of the same
>>> organizations looking at the exact same stuff," Todd said.
>>>
>>> But Waxman rejected the rationale. "You halted an investigation,
>>> demanded a personal briefing from the Justice Department, (and)
>>> assigned your congressional affairs director to keep tabs on the
>>> investigation," Waxman said to Krongard at the hearing. Waxman  
>>> called
>>> the moves "highly unorthodox."
>>>
>>> Heide, the congressional affairs director Krongard called his "alter
>>> ego," was collecting the documents needed by Bowen and the U.S
>>> Attorney's office, e-mails show.
>>>
>>> But members of Krongard's own staff, along with Higdon and  
>>> Candelmo of
>>> the U.S. attorney's office in North Carolina, saw her as a  
>>> roadblock.
>>> Rubendall told the committee Candelmo and Higdon planned in  
>>> advance to
>>> raise grand jury information during the July 31 meeting in order to
>>> force Heide out of the room.
>>>
>>> "We weren't going to discuss grand jury material, but that was the
>>> ruse that they were going to use to get her out of the meeting,"
>>> Rubendall said.
>>>
>>> Heide referred questions to her attorney, David Laufman, who said an
>>> e-mail exchange between Krongard and Heide indicated she was  
>>> doing as
>>> directed.
>>>
>>> "I am trying to stay only situationally aware," she wrote Aug. 8,  
>>> "so
>>> I can keep any conflicts at bay."
>>>
>>> According to Waxman, the problems hampering the Blackwater probe
>>> persist. Justice investigators have been unable to get needed
>>> documents. Militana has not been allowed to give his full  
>>> attention to
>>> the criminal investigation even though Krongard said he would.
>>>
>>> "I think that the State Department is responsible for investigating
>>> crimes perpetrated against the State Department," Militana said  
>>> in an
>>> October interview with the committee. "The (Justice Department)  
>>> can do
>>> it, of course, but there has to be some involvement by the State
>>> Department."
>>>
>>> Copyright © 2007 The Associated Press. All rights reserved.
>>>
>>
>> -- 
>>
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>> ---
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> GroveNet mailing list
>> GroveNet at rdrop.com
>> http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/grovenet
> _______________________________________________
> GroveNet mailing list
> GroveNet at rdrop.com
> http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/grovenet